Electric Fuel Pump SU v Hardi

[geoberni]

Hi there folks. I had minor problem with fuel pump (sticky points) and have considered that at Monty's age (56) I might just change the fuel pump complete and have looked at SU vs Hardi on the ESM website (I trust ESM and am sure they will be selling the correct Hardi pump to suit the pressure needs of the Morris Minor). Financially, the Hardi is less than half price of the SU (I am negative earth these days - apologies to purists - Negative earth SU pump approx £25 even more expensive than positive earth one!), which has immediately has made me worry about the quality of the Hardi pumps. The SU certainly looks a more robust item. I then saw the full repair kit and wondered about restoring my SU - is it so very difficult? Then just to throw a spanner in the works there is an electronic conversion kit, which would take away the points side of things. I notice there are no repair kits for the Hardi, which would seem to make it a throw away item. Although, like everyone else, I have to mind the pennies, I am inclined to think that if I have any further problems, the easiest option will be to just go the whole hog and get a new SU pump, not for originality, but for dependabilty.

Although ESM are generally seen as trustworthy (I've got no complaints about their service but there's been some disgruntled rumblings recently on facebook about their Customer Support), the fact is that Hardi do not make a pump with as low a delivery pressure as the SU. Their lowest pressure pump is almost twice the pressure of the SU.
Like any other business, ESM are seeking to sell to customers; Hardi market the pump as suitable, ESM aren't going to question it.

Yes there are SU electronic ones which do away with the points; my personal view is that if the electronic one fails, a tap on the top to free a sticky set of points isn't going to get it working. Therefore I prefer the traditional arrangement.
The overhaul kit is quite easy to use and there are videos on youtube of people overhauling the SU.

The simple fact is that the SU fuel pump is probably the most ignored item on the car. People work on engines, gearboxes, all manner of items, but few think to check the points on their fuel pump or even check the inbuilt filter, until it starts misbehaving.
The SU is an excellent bit of kit, it just needs a little bit of love every so often....

[svenedin]

The SU pump is undoubtedly expensive but it is still made in Salisbury, England probably in exactly the same way as it always has been (Burlen bought the SU tooling). They are very robust pumps and I have successfully brought back really dreadful looking pre-war SU pumps to perfect working order which shows how durable they are. Fully overhauling an SU fuel pump is not difficult but requires patience and a clean, well lit working area. You will also need some BA sockets or a small adjustable spanner and feeler gauges. They are some good Youtube videos you can watch.

I use my Morris year round. My garage is damp and I found that the points version of the SU had a tendency to misbehave on cold, damp mornings. I converted a pump (I have quite a few of them) to electronic with the kit a few years back and performance has been absolutely faultless. As Berni says, if the electronic unit fails that's it whereas you would probably be able to coax a points back to good enough to get you home. The other disadvantage with the electronic version is that it is polarity sensitive. My car is positive earth but if I ever wanted to change to negative earth I would have to change the electronic module which is expensive. If you are already negative earth the chances of you wanting to go back are practically zero so this is not an issue. One thing to note is that if the pump is very old and has two black wires to the coil, Burlen do not recommend conversion to electronic.

Stephen

[myoldjalopy]

A long time ago, I had an SU pump that was failing. Giving it a clout got it going again but it kept failing with increasing frequency. In the end, I had to stop every two or three miles to give the pump a whack! PITA on a busy A-road! Eventually, I tried cleaning the points but they were too far gone and only replacement of the points cured the issue. Moral of the story - once the points start playing up, they will continue to do so. I shouldn't have ignored the problem for so long, but I was young and foolish in those days and knew next to nothing about car maintenance
As insurance, I now keep a spare pump fitted with new points in the boot.

[The Scotmoose]

Thank you guys for getting back. So far I have been lucky and Monty has kept on working and I have started saving my pennies. Going to put a new SU and get the kit for the one I have so I have a spare. It is great the amount of knowledge and experience we have here and I for one am grateful for any advice I receive.

[geoberni]

Your response above caused me to re-read your past comments.
I don't get this remark...

(I am negative earth these days - apologies to purists - Negative earth SU pump approx £25 even more expensive than positive earth one!),

An SU Electronic Pump, Positive or Negative, are both around £200.

An SU Points Pump, which is not polarity conscious, is around £170.

[The Scotmoose]

I think that I will go down the line of new SU "points" pump. That click click is somehow reassuring that it is actually working.

[myoldjalopy]

Quite so - as long as you can hear it over the noise of the engine and the various squeaks, creaks, rattles and clonks from the rest of the car!

[oliver90owner]

Quite so - as long as you can hear it over the noise of the engine and the various squeaks, creaks, rattles and clonks from the rest of the car!

No real problem. One would generally be satisfied it is operational before starting the engine each day. The ‘click click’ - and then nothing - demonstrates it is working and that neither the carburettor is being overfilled nor the pump not attaining regulated pressure for some other reason.

[myoldjalopy]

My remark was in the nature of a very light-hearted joke. But to address your point, the fact that the pump ticks on turning on the ignition is no guarantee that it will continue to do so during driving, a fact that I and many others have learnt through previous experience.......

[oliver90owner]

the fact that the pump ticks on turning on the ignition is no guarantee that it will continue to do so during driving

Agreed, but no different to the engine, gearbox, rear axle suspension, etc failing while driving. Few things go wrong while the vehicle is parked overnight - but those few can prevent the car operating correctly, of course. The ticking of the fuel pump is a fairly definite indication that the pump has not failed overnight,

[olonas]

I do have an electronic pump fitted (S.U. pos. earth) and that does still have the reassuring clicking at ignition on and when driving.
However, as an indication of my faith in that pump I still carry the working points pump, it replaced, in the boot.